Hi, I went through the setup and alignment of the ATC with the alignment disc per instructions. Each slot seemed aligned fine. Slot 1 I have a 1/4" end mill (Tool #1), and I am trying to load a 1/4" VBit into any other slot. I’ve configured the tool database and set the appropriate tool # in Vectric, changing it and recalculating the toolpaths if I change the tool number. When the program tries to swap bits, it unloads slot 1 fine, but when it loads any other slot, the bit is aligned crooked in the collett. I did some manual loads and unloads via the interface and same issue. The sensors light up for each slot. Question: Should the collet slide under the sensor light (light goes off when collet fully seated low) or should the collet ALWAYS trigger the LED (collet sits higher toward the top of the slot)? It didn’t seem to make a difference either way. I’ve tried 2 different collets and 2 different VBits and same issue arises. The bits appear to be straight in the collet insert, so it seems the collet nut is not threading onto the spindle straight. I may try to re-align the ATC slots again but in the meantime, any thoughts?
Which controller are you using?
I’m using the Redline controller
I reset the socket alignment using the Wizard, then verified axis alignment by running a bit down the backside of the ATC and looking if it was crooked, but it is straight all the way across.
And spindle is square to the ATC magazine, and level on all 4 sides. Gantry is level as well. Trying to eliminate micro-alignment of the spindle in case there is high sensitivity there. VFD shows spindle running at just about 1800rpm during loading, is that okay and is there a way to change it if it’s too fast? The issue seems to be on the 2nd descent of the spindle - it secures the collet nut on the first descent, but when it goes down the 2nd time, is when it seems to almost crossthread - the bit is usually straight in the collet but crooked in the nut.
Each error is a Sensor failure error. It unloads bits fine, the error is always on loading a new bit (loaded individually, or using the swap button), same issue/symptom every time.
Are you correctly ‘snapping’ each collet into the nut first, prior to placing the endmill into the collet to the desired depth?
For good measure, check also that none of the inner tool cups are threaded too high in the outer pocket - likely not the issue but good to confirm.
I do not own this controller, but I believe the load/unload RPMs can be changed by the user. Note that there has been some discussion that higher load RPMs are actually better - search the forum for the discussion.
I am clicking the collets into the nut, yes. I also see some discussion on Engage height and upper/lower sensor heights perhaps being too wide by default - are there recommended settings or a recommended delta between Upper and Lower sensors and Engage Height? Mine are Reference height 70.64mm, Engage height 100.14mm, Upper sensor 76.14mm, and Lower sensor 80.14mm - willing to try but not sure which of these to change to test?
None of the inside cups are above the lower ‘floor’ of the nut holder socket. Some are lower, but none are proud of the nut holder socket
You’ve done some good investigating thus far, but to save time, it may be best to upload a screenshot of the ATC settings/parameters page as well as the tool table. Also, a video of the successful tool loading followed by the failing tool changes would also be helpful for those helping you to identify the issue(s). Onefinity support, if not already communicating with them, will likely ask for this information anyway so it is a time well spent IMO to create and share it.
Thanks! How do we upload photos/videos here?
I’ve also updated the title here, turns out I had a collet that was not clicking into the nut every time, which led to the crooked bits. That issue hasn’t returned with very rare exceptions, so focusing more on the load/unload sensor errors I’m getting.
I did adjust the Height sensors (not at the machine right now but I think I have the difference at 5mm now instead of 4 and the issue is marginally better but still more often than not which still messes up a multi-tool job.
I do not own this type of ATC, although I was intrigued enough by it that I had reached out to Don at RapidChange a long time ago to discuss it with him.
Besides contacting Onefinity support, I would perhaps first reach out to Don to discuss thew sensor tuning issues you feel you are having - he is the ultimate expert and will likely have a quick answer and solution.
Have you checked the Z feed rate in your settings?
Per this post, Important: Redline Controller feed Rate Requirement, RapidChange support states:
“Your feed rate must be set to at least 78.6 IPM (2000 mm/min)”
Worth checking even if it isn’t the root cause, it’s probably best to ensure it’s set to RapidChange’s standard.
Thanks. Is this on the ATC Settings (Feed Rate - currently 1000mm/min) or the Motor Drivers Settings (Tool set speed Coarse or fine (500mm/min and 100mm/min respectively)
On ATC Settings my load speed is 1500RPM and unload is 2100RPM.
That is how fast the spindle is turning
Feed rate is how fast your spindle is going up and down - the reason that is hella important is because of the thread pitch of the ER20 collet nuts - you want to match that speed so the nut doesn’t move and stays fully seated in the pocket and engages the pins to apply pressure to tighten the nut - if your feed rate is too high it will grind into the threads - too low and the nut can slip up out of the pins and not tighten at all
Thanks - are these settings generally okay (they are the defaults)
yes, for sure - the feed rate and spindle speed are tied together in a way if you make the spindle speed faster, the feed rate has to increase slightly or the nut moves up the threads faster - BUT - that is minor - but you can calculate it.
Unless you are having issues with the collet not tightening enough on smaller bit then i would not touch those settings
At least not issues caused by the actual tightening - if the collets are becoming dislodged from the locking clip during removsl, that is a different issue.
these ER style collets are used in millions of machine shops worldwide and the collets are typically a bear to remove, having them just pop out is NOT normal and I would make sure you have quality nuts to the correct dimension and also check you collets.
I have seen too many giant pieces of metal come flying off at INSANE speeds to skimp on that stuff - 70hp spindles are by far a different league, but you have to respect them at all time no matter what.
