Another step forward

This is a cross post from Facebook (Official Grp)

My Elite Foreman with the Sola Fide Designs KC spindle/ATC (Serial Number 2) has arrived. This thing is a beast. I enlisted my wife and daughter to get the machine inside… once we got it inside, they revolted and refused to help carry it to the basement… imagine that?

Here is a partial list of what is in the package.

  • Elite Foreman, with Stiffy and upgraded Z axis
    -Z stepper upgraded by Sola Fide Designs KC
  • Pendant wheel
  • 3D touch probe & bit setter
  • 2.2 Kw Spindle with ISO 30 ATC spindle from CNCDepot in Tennessee
  • Control box from Sola Fide Designs KC, Houses VFD and controls

I know folks are anxious to see it work, but I have a truck…. And a family member who is moving. Which means Dec. 1’st is when the 1F starts to get serious work.

I will also start a YouTube channel to document my experience as a pre-release user, aka crash test dummy. I will say this is the machine I wanted, my goal was to take the 1F (good bones) out of the “hobbyist” level and try to breach the “commercial” level. I will discuss what that means in the YouTube.

Incidentally I have paid for everything, nothing was gifted… my opinions are not influenced, except by machine performance.


Hey Carl and Lynn,

I think that many here have been waiting to see this. Hope you can post a few images here soon, of how the spindle is attached and how Z assembly works!

Looking forward to your progress and enjoyment of your new machine :grinning:

Just posted an update… hope you don’t mind a PDF. Until I start adding web pages this will have to do.

CandL Workshop- XAxis with Spindle.pdf (179.1 KB)

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Hey Carl and Lynn,

thank you for showing the new spindle and custom spindle mount on the Onefinity!

Too bad you did not have a flash to illuminate the black spindle mount between spindle and Z assembly. I cannot see much of it.

Love this! I already consider my 1F to be a ‘Professional Grade’ machine, and have listed it as such on my (very non-professional) web page as well as my North Valley CNC LinkedIn profile. Onefinity provides a truly commercial grade machine (the ‘bones’, as you stated). How the end user puts the system together determines the difference between a serious hobby machine vs. a commercial grade machine.

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Aiph5u , It will get better … chuckle. Likely to do a full write up on the mount, this is just to let you know you are not forgotten.

It has been a week since it arrived, and just yesterday I got two younger guys to carry it downstairs.

I like that they designed it to keep it as close to the X axis as possible. :+1:

There is still quite a bit of torque being applied to the X Axis. (Which is why the stiffy option.) When we lifted the sled to carry it downstairs it immediately wanted to rotate.

I found it interesting that the stiffy option is not colinear with the bottom two tubes. It would be interesting to do a finite element model of X axis deflections … yeah in my free time. Who needs sleep anyways.

By the way these upgrades are NOT sanctioned by 1F in any way or form. I am sure I violated my warranty before I ever recieved my machine.

I decided to purchase a 3rd rail, and picked it up and installed it this week.
My testing showed a reduction in deflection in all of the 3 areas I investigated, although I made no attempt to determine if the results were statistically significant.

I am always impressed when I see the FEA of people’s CNC designs on the other forums I frequent. I have not looked at how to set it up, but it must be fairly involved and time intensive, but perhaps it is more the model creation and less setting up each test.

Remember, lift with your legs, not your back (and/or keep getting the help of friends and family) :smile:

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TMToronto, actually FEA is not really that hard, at least to get rough numbers. You know I use FreeCad, well it actually has a decent little FEA package included.

For my CNC class I am making a welding clamp, so you know I had to do a quick model. The nice thing is we should be able to measure the deflection under load to verify the model.

Hey Tom, hey Carl and Lynn, hey all,

It always looks impressing but it says nothing if you are not able to provide a lot of data to make the results meaningful. I remember one user posted this in order to judge on whether it would have an acceptable deflection when making the 35 mm Y rails 48" long (that was when nobody knew that a Foreman would be released one day). I found that it was not meaningful because I did not see the data used for this but judge yourself.

It’s true you can do this with a lot of softwares including the one Carl and Lynn mentioned (FEM Tutorial).

Do you mean the data that is input by the user - material type, dimensions, etc - that the FEA is using for its calculations and results?

Hey Tom,

how do I even know that he knew what was the wall strength of the 35 mm chrome-plated hardened hollow steel shafts. I think not everybody would know it. Or better, if you want to show deflection of the rails: Think of the play in the linear bearings.

I want to know the deflection too but I can get results faster empirically :slight_smile:

Aiph5u … Ok so you want to see report out of how the analysis was done, a reasonable request. But like my earlier PDF post, expect to read 3-5 pages.

And you are right some analysis decisions will be made… ie your tubing, but assuming those decisions are documented and reasonable i.e. the material “unobtainum” was not used … those numbers should be sound.

I would also argue measuring distances of “0.0006 in” can in itself be a challenge. At that level of precision, you almost want to know at what temperature … the ole’ aplha delta T issue, chuckle.

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The realized deflection of the entire machine as a ‘system’ when machining, for me at least, is what I am most interested in.

The members of the forums whose builds I follow know a lot about their materials, and a lot of their analysis is interesting if not helpful in that it often compares switching materials and dimensions. For example one build successfully uses a ‘sandwich’ of engineered plywood between two metal plates. It was informative to see the impact of changing from aluminum to steel sheet, 5 mm to 10 mm, and single to multiple ply in the sandwich.

I think I shared this link I found with you earlier -

I like that he provides the file for us to experiment with, and in particular for me as I am interested most in modifying a Z axis assembly design.

What a great hobby we have - keeps my older brain very active! :smile:

I will stop diluting Carl’s discussion and focus now.

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Hey Tom,

I did not say that everything that you get as results even if the data are not perfect is useless, not at all. I just wanted to emphasize that – maybe also because the images you can generate are so impressive – you should always be aware of exactly how good and how accurate the information is, or is not. Of course you can illustrate and recognize a lot of basic information about material twisting even with only approximate data, I didn’t want to diminish that. But I have been working with data analysis and statistics for a long time, and I have found that just a curve in a coordinate system can impress many people to confirm something that someone claims just because it looks like that. I am very sensitized to this. I was also just referring to the example above, which was not so inviting to agree with, given the data I was shown about it.

Haven’t followed the youtube link yet but I will do! And I believe you if you say “The members of the forums whose builds I follow know a lot about their materials”, you can point me to interesting information at any time, I appreciate that as you know :slight_smile:

Indeed. As I wrote in the other thread.

Interesting Master’s Thesis out of U. of British Columbia:

Mechanics and dynamics of the tool holder-spindle interface - UBC Library Open Collections

And yes, he uses finite elements … chuckle. (includes experimental validation)

In section 6.2 Future Research Directions:
“The tool holder spindle connection is vital in determining the overall dynamics of the machine tool and the accuracy of the machined part since 15-20% of the deflection at the tool tip is contributed by the tool holder-spindle interface.”

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Interesting article - thank you for sharing it.

It adds to the understanding and appreciation that there numerous factors that combine to impact deflection at the tool.

Not that I am in a position to start investing in a new build any time soon, but I have been considering trying a different tool holder system - the HSK in particular.

The spindle manufactures that have these as options are the higher price point range from what I have seen, but interesting to investigate regardless. Not sure if going larger is better - perhaps you are becoming more of an expert in this area through the course you are taking, and the practical and theoretical machining experience you are gaining as a result.

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Chuckle, I am far from an expert. Hopefully I am less stupid though. My motto is “Anyday I don’t do something stupid is a great day” … I don’t have many of those.

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