QCW secure waste board from top/bottom, any opinions?

[dennizens (Mark Dennis)]

I ordered the QCW secure waste board from top, any disadvantages to this method. I dont like the idea of using a flimsy template to drill all the mounting holes but i felt it would be easier to change out waste board later, I ordered the elite forman?

[Aiph5u (Aiph5u (not affiliated with Onefinity))]

Hey Mark,

The QCW Frame “Secure from above” has swage nuts.

@Aiph5u

Image 1: A pair of swage nuts
(-- Source: Douglas W. Jones, CC0, via Wikimedia Commons)

@OnefinityCNC

Hope this helps!

If you order “secure from above”, you got to drill all the countersink holes into the wasteboard slats, but it avoids that you have to do this (the need to tilt up the entire machine on “secure from beneath”):

@Aiph5u

@DaddyDan

Do you or anyone know what these are and where they go?

yes, I know

See The Fine Manual

@Aiph5u

@Aiph5u

…I think you should only buy the secure from beneath version if your enclosure allows to do this:

I find “Secure from above” better because you can leave your CNC in place when you attach the wasteboard slats. And regarding the holes you need to drill for the countersunk bolts, you can create a toolpath for a new wasteboard slat set and simply mill it everytime you need new ones and you can even cut the slats out all with your CNC machine.

When drilling the holes for the countersunk bolts for “Secure from above” by hand I suggest this:

@Aiph5u

Note that in case you don’t make the MDF wasteboard slats with a g-code program run on the machine, but by hand as shown in the manual or in the video, you will notice that for the 9.5 mm / 3/8″ deep holes for the screw heads, they use a forstner bit and as depth stop they suggest marking the depth with tape on the drill bit, however for acceptable depth accuracy and repeatability I would suggest better using these nice and ingenious Star-M Depth stops :

The plastic cap rotates freely and stops rotating when you reach desired depth.

I use a set of them, from 3 mm (=approx. 1/8″) drill diameter upwards. Picture shows ⌀ 15 mm drill (=approx 19/32″). Available here or here

@Aiph5u

@Auntjemimma

The swage nut is Threaded for 10-32. I found them on eBay as well, do you know how to install these inserts into the metal?

with an arbor press or by tightening a screw through the hole. The hole has to be pre-drilled to the appropriate diameter.

@Auntjemimma

The swag nut is Threaded for 10-32.

Then I am glad that I did not order “secure from above” but “secure from below” to use my own to get “secure from above”, but with ordinary M5 threads!

@Aiph5u

I also wanted to have the “secure from above” version, but since before ordering I was not sure whether possibly imperial threads were used (not common outside the U.S., so definetely not wanted), I ordered the “secure from below” version and got me a bunch of “Setzmuttern M5 ”, so that I can install the swage nuts myself and be sure of the thread used.

[JimHatch]

@dennizens

I dont like the idea of using a flimsy template to drill all the mounting holes

Or use that precision 1F “drill” and cut them to the dimensions & spacing needed to simply drop into place. It’s easy using Vectric or Carveco. Just take the measurements from your QCW and not the drawing. I found the drawing’s slat widths were speced narrower than the actual QCW was built when I did my JMan. I had to adjust the drawing after I found out (& cut 6 of the slats)

[dennizens (Mark Dennis)]

Many thanks for the recommendation, sorry for the mistake wasting all your time and boards!

[dennizens (Mark Dennis)]

Many thanks for the recommendation, unfortunately the sights are in EU and the first one will not let me ship to US ( selected US and no payment option) also lead times by boat may not make it. But nice solution for forstner , i did see any other solution on internet.

[dennizens (Mark Dennis)]

Thank you for your response and details

[Aiph5u (Aiph5u (not affiliated with Onefinity))]

Hey Mark,

I think some forum members already made a toolpath for their “secure from above” QCW frame to be able to re-create a set of wasteboard slats with the Onefinity machine when needed, including holes for bench dogs, t-nuts, or insert nuts. I think this is the best solution.

I belong to those who consider a machine enclosure as mandatory (broken bit debris flying around, ouch) and I have not yet seen a machine enclosure that allows the machine to be tilted up in order to “secure from below”. Besides, if I want wasteboard slats with dog holes or t-nuts anyway, it makes no difference whether my toolpath includes the holes for “securing from above”. It’s all in one, and quickly done, and all without any physical exercise because of the need of lifting the machine.

If you consider making the holes manually, the Star-M drill depth stops originate from Japan and should be available in different tool shops in North America. They should fit any type of bit, I already used them with forstner bits. The bit shown above is a bit for hand use in a brace. Here some more drill bits shown:

Image: Star-M drill depth stops with ø 5 mm and ø 6 mm Auger bits (for hand brace or slow-running cordless drill) and 15 mm ø Forstner bit (with ø 8 mm bit shank) (FAMAG BORMAX) (for power drill)

[tahoe1840 (Scott D)]

I just completed the setup of my Journeyman QCW secure from above. I used a drill press with a fence, bit stop and took the time to be sure the table was level and straight to the bit used. This worked great although be aware that the quality control over the swag nuts is not looked carefully at. I found 2 out of the many that had poor threads. One had no thread at all. On these two I had to punch the swags out and use the same bolts washer and a purchased metric ny-lock.

[dennizens (Mark Dennis)]

Hi Scott, thank you for the tips, more than likely the way i will go. I can always test on one board and if good move forward with the rest. Sounds like i might need to buy some additional swag nuts and will test prior to install. You may have saved me some problems. I haven’t seen the template yet as i dont have the equipment, do they give you the measurements or did you have to go the manual way of laying it out and taping to the piece of MDF as per the video?

[Aiph5u (Aiph5u (not affiliated with Onefinity))]

The templates are here

https://onefinitycnc.com/support

Note that there is one QCW Manual for Foreman and one for the other variants.

[Geige (Tom Wert)]

I have had my Onefinity for probably more that two years, and I did not have to change the wasteboard.

For me there is no reason to use the secure from top wasteboard at all.

Why make things complicated.

[dennizens (Mark Dennis)]

Ah, Yes thank you for the link helps much!

[dennizens (Mark Dennis)]

Understood, thanks for letting me know, yeah i am not sure how manay of these i will go through but as you state and a few other comments i have seen looks like you wont need a new waste board too often!

[PeterK26 (Peter Klein)]

I didn’t bother with the template.
I cut my boards to be a neat fit between the slotted rails clamped them one at a time marked the hole positions through the back, and then drilled them out on the drill press with a fence no measuring involved.

[dennizens (Mark Dennis)]

Dang, Thank you for the great method!

[tahoe1840 (Scott D)]

Mark, I would recommend not using the template at all. Actually from my reading and advice from 1F the templates can be off a bit so don’t use. Mark each hole from underneath and carefully drill them out using a drill press or hand drill with a square or something to be sure you are straight, I agree with Peter.

[MStoica (Marian Stoica)]

I failed on that miserably. Especially since I didn’t have a template - as far as I understood, there are no templates for the Elite Foreman series.
What NOT to do: I tried to make my own template… but not having the possibility to print 4f in one sheet of paper, I did 2 papers (since there are 2 different distances between the holes, some are closer to each other and some are further apart). And moving the “half template” across the mdf strip to mark the holes. What happened is: I was off by just a bit on the second hole, plus a just a bit on the 3rd or 4th, so that added up, and you can imagine what I got :))

What I ended up doing: After doing the above and failing twice, I decided to actually use the machine itself to drill the holes/pockets, using a 1/8" bit. So I jumped into Fusion and did the program, using 1F provided measurements regarding the QCW, and it turned out perfectly.

But be careful, because you would get that bit very close to the actual frame. I’ve offset it to 1/32" (simply lied to it that the material is that much thicker than it actually was). Then I easily punched in with a bit, by hand, through the very thin remaining mdf material at the bottom of the hole.

Edit: I’ve just read other comments here, people saying they marked the holes from underneath. Sounds like a great idea, I wish I though of that before I mounted everything There was no way for me to get the machine off the QCW or lift it altogether.

[Aiph5u (Aiph5u (not affiliated with Onefinity))]

Hey Marian,

@MStoica

as far as I understood, there are no templates for the Elite Foreman series.

the templates for Foreman model is here (PDF) (under https://www.onefinitycnc.com/support).

[MStoica (Marian Stoica)]

Thanks!
That’s where I got the measurements from.
Sorry for the misunderstanding, but I actually meant to say “there is no template (physical piece of paper) shipped with the Elite Foreman series”.
I used those measurements (from the PDF you also shared) to create the program to pocket the holes.
Because I do not have the possibility to print anything 4ft long, in one piece of paper. And trying to split it across multiple A4 size pages didn’t work out as I hoped it would.

[Aiph5u (Aiph5u (not affiliated with Onefinity))]

Hey Marian,

now I understand.

Ususally printer drivers have a function for exanding to multiple pages but in any case I think creating a g-code toolpath that allows to re-create a set of wasteboard slats with the Onefinity machine is a fine thing. Especially if you want additional dog holes, t-nuts etc.