Hey Carl, or Lynn, or both,
I don’t know – what I found is that it is not always clear what you mean or that it is not always easy to follow you.
I don’t see pushy in your response, I see a lot of discussion around tool deflection, .0005 concerns and coming from owning a large machine shop, I totally relate to your comments, this is wood and wood is soft and full of stress and moves when machining as do most metal parts.
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I am new, like a lot on here, I am trying to decide between Elite Onefinity or AR8 Pro 5Axiom. Has anyone on here ever used the Axiom and can give me an honest opinion as to which has better customer support and quality build. I know the Axiom is a lot more $$$ and I plan on just being a part time fiddle around in my little shop guy.
Their biggest is 1/2 the size of the Elite Foreman and double the cost, only 300ipm vs the elites 400 (can be set higher), about the same gantry clearance, but looks like open loop steppers vs our closed loop steppers.
From what we can tell, their controller is not an industrial controller like the Masso is that the Elite has.
Either will do you just fine, but (obviously we’re biased) you get much more for your Money 
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I own a Onefinity Woodworker that I upgraded to a Masso G3 controller several years ago. I do not own or have experience with the Axiom CNCs.
My initial personal opinions (in no particular order):
- Although the Axiom does not require a computer, it uses a pendant controller. I do not like these, mostly due to the small display, and especially compared to using the Masso (I added a separate touch screen to mine - similar in functionality to the Touch).
- I am not a fan of a single ballscrew solution to control the motion of the 2 Y axes. My opinion is its implementation will not be as rigid as dual Y linear motion solutions, like on the Onefinity.
- I prefer linear rails and blocks, and will most likely build my next CNC using these. However, when looking at the Axiom CNC, and the X axis gantry in particular, it is made of a very narrow (20x160?) aluminum extrusion. I believe any benefit from linear rails will be lost due to the flex in the thin gantry.
- I am only ever interested in the overall structure and linear motion components, as the rest I prefer to source or build myself. Therefore, I have no opinion on the electronics, spindle, tool setter etc, which I could not find details on anyway.
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I’ll be calling Onefinity in the next few days, and get some verification on a few minor things. I’m leaning more toward the Elite as I finally found a video that helped me get an idea of how to use the Masso. I’m hoping I can find an in-depth version so I can understand more of what needs to be done. Thanks for the reply, I appreciate that.
Eldon
Fast forward 1 year. I bought an X-50 Woodworker in Feb of 2002. Now a year later having used the X-50 for a variety of carves and looking at all the specs and features of the Elite, hands down, I want an Elite or more importantly a Masso Controller with its homing system on my X-50 for the following reasons. By the way, I’m a technical guy and think I purchased the best built, most ridged, reliable machine in its class at a very affordable price point.
Buildbotics
- 3D carve: Even with a separate file for all toolpaths, your committed to the machine being powered until the carve is done. That could be hours or days depending on the complexity of the carve, and pray the power doesn’t go out or a bit breaks. You can’t rely on “stall homing” to accurately put you back to the same point the carve started, even if you logged the X,Y 0 values prior to a power/restart issue.
- Lack of adjusting feed rate, real time during a carve. Result, stop carve, erase file, go back to computer and adjust the file, reload.
- Whether your seasoned or a beginner, you’ll come to realize these 2 things are very significant operational deficiencies.
Elite/Masso - Machine is “beefed up” on X and Z mechanically. However for my Hobbyist needs, not a big deal.
- Machine has a reliable, repeatable homing system.
- Stores/Backs up machine positions to easily resume a project if an issue arises.
- Feed rate can be adjusted on the fly while in the start, middle, or end of a project, you’ll come to appreciate that!
5: Supports a 4th axis for rotary carving.
Down Side - For me, like the Game Pad to move the machine around, base Masso is touch screen only.
My opinion, buy the Elite, I would gladly pay the difference for the added features. But, the X-50 is meeting all my expectations as a Hobbyist, as well, you just have to really plan your project, oversee it, and pray the power doesn’t go out, a bit break, or you have to E-Stop. Most likely, new material and start over.
FYI, If the Elite upgrade kit is reasonably priced, no brainer for me, upgrade time!
Think of this as a 1 time investment, don’t cheap out, because all the upgrades add up. It would be cheaper to pay for the better, feature rich machine up front, then the continual upgrades to deficiencies you’ll come to realize when you get to using the cheaper machine. I wished the Elite was available when I bought mine as there would be an Elite on my table instead!
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If you post your questions here, we can answer them and others can learn from them as well!
Hello again, the questions I’ve come up with for now are, What version of Vectri VCarve Pro will I get, and does it come with Photo-Vcarve included? According to the Axiom site, on their training on line page, the Photo Vcarve is now included with Pro. Next, and more importantly, is there an in depth training video on how to use the Masso? I will also be ordering the PWC 2.2kw 80 mm spindle and kit. Will I be able to install this on the Elite and have it work with the Masso as well? Finally, I’ve read a couple of horror stories on delivery being dropped off at the curb and just left. I know there isn’t a 100% guarantee this won’t happen, but I really need a guarantee signature upon delivery. I also live alone, and will need a lift gate so the CNC can be lowered onto a trailer so I can get it to my work shop. Well, that’s about it for today, I will probably come up with more tomorrow as I sleep and dream CNC tonight…LOL Thanks everyone.
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Thank you very much. You make a lot of since and a very convincing “Opinion”. The more I see on here with people willing and ready to help me make a decision, the closer I am to calling Onefinity, not just to answer questions, that will probably be answered on here, but to go ahead and place my order. It sounds like it will be a few months before delivery, so it would give me time to watch more videos and get a Kreg stand ordered and set up. The training videos on the Masso are the big thing I truly hope to find.
Hey Eldon,
in your first post you said you’re very new to this, are you also new to using CAD/CAM software? If so, learning to use a CAD/CAM software, especially 3D modeling, takes considerable amount of time to master it, I think much more than learning to use the Masso CNC controller.
The good thing is that if you buy, you can get the licence for VCarve Pro and export your toolpaths (not possible with free trial version) and feed them into the CAMotics.org 3D toolpath simulation (while still waiting for the machine). That’s the simulation also shown on the Standard Series Onefinity Controller.
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I suggest looking to Masso resources as well to see how it works, as it won’t matter too much which brand of CNC router it is controlling.
Besides Masso’s online manual and forums, which are excellent, I suggest you start watching CNCNutz’s videos - he covers almost everything you will need to know.
You buy it separately, make your own choice. See the Vectric website for guidance on what to buy. Basically it comes down to 2 major things. If you want to use the entire 4’x4’ area you need VCarve Pro or you need to do tiling. If you want to do custom 3D designs you need Aspire. If you want to save money when getting started, buy VCarve and upgrade later as you need the larger work area or 3D design. VCarve and VCarve Pro can both do 3D cutting of pre-designed pieces, but you need Aspire or some other 3D program to design your own.
I will also be ordering the PWC 2.2kw 80 mm spindle and kit. Will I be able to install this on the Elite and have it work with the Masso as well?
They have a kit for the Elite. You need to buy the right kit to get the right cable.
Finally, I’ve read a couple of horror stories on delivery being dropped off at the curb and just left. I know there isn’t a 100% guarantee this won’t happen, but I really need a guarantee signature upon delivery. I also live alone, and will need a lift gate so the CNC can be lowered onto a trailer so I can get it to my work shop.
I have a woodworker, it came in 3 boxes that were left on my front porch. No need for a lift gate, they were about 50lbs a box.
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Thank you all for the replies. I will be calling to place my order … You are all awesome.
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If you buy Vectric (not included) you’d get either vcarve pro or desktop (depending on which one you purchase from our store. What things include are here: Products Compare Page | Vectric
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Masso has a ton of information here: https://docs.masso.com.au/ and here: CNCnutz (Peter Passuello) - YouTube and we are adding more weekly here: Onefinity CNC - YouTube and others are adding more on their channels like: Onefinity CNC ELITE Series Foreman - First In-Depth Look! - YouTube
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We don’t ship with signature on deliver, but if you call, they can help you add this service for an extra cost.
We don’t use lift gate as each box is 50ish pounds.
Hope that helps!
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It helps greatly, thank you, and I will be ordering one today. Thanks again.
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Okay, I finally made my choice, it’s on order and due to ship in 18 - 20 weeks. Plenty of time to watch youtube and get the Kreg stand in place. Thanks again for all the inputs and suggestions.
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Hey Eldon,
if you think of byuing Vectric Aspire in order to be able to use 3D model creation and editing tools, instead of Vectric VCarve Pro, which means you have a big price difference for this additional capability (USD $1,995 vs. $699), you should know that you can also use many other softwares to create your 3D models, e.g. the free and open Blender as mentioned here:
More on other free and open tools here
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Thank you, I just went with the VCarve Pro for now. Figured it probably more than I will ever need as it is. I will definitely check out these as well, just in case.
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Surprise, I may be slow but I keep moving. I found where I had already asked about the spindle, thank you again. I also reached out to PWN and got confirmation. I will supply them with my order number, and they ship the spindle a few days before my Elite ships, and it is plug and play ready. Thanks again for your patience and information.
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