I am still in the process of setting up the Elite Foreman but I seem to be running in to homing issues.
Either homing seems to take forever (or stalls) or is stuck on (something like) “wait for homing to finish” OR I get a flashing red light and one of my masso motors flashes red/green (Y rail on RHS which would suggest the source of the issue)
Secondly - How do I ‘reset’ this situation when it arises. My power button is not working (have asked for replacement) and so the only way I can resolve it by pulling the power wire.
“This is (NOT) the way”.
I will contact support after the weekend but in the interim…Ideas?
I am having a similar issue on my Elite, I can home it just fine but if I shut it down in the home position, you have to home again anytime you power the machine, i get a “B” Motor error, I have to manually move the gantry off of the home switches (sensors) then it will home fine again, just not when the machine is in the home position already, 1F is working on this for me now.
Pat
I would play with pull off distance (to alleviate the switch errors) start at like 5mm then adjust up or down, and maybe homing speed (if it’s too slow).
The goal should be to have the pull off distance far enough it doesn’t trigger the sensors anymore, and the speed, something comfortably slow but not so slow it times out and not so fast you can’t remove obstructions.
The pull off is at 5MM now, I have tried homing speed from 10 to 100 inches a min, no change, I will try a little more pull off and see what happens and let you know.
Pat
I was wrong on the pull off, it was .019 instead of .19 so I changed it to .100 and it seems to be working now.
Except, I also notice that the position of the gantry after homing is not always the same, the gap between the sensor bracket and the foot can be off by as much as .100, visual to the eye, you don’t need to measure it. Sometimes it looks to be pretty even but not all the time.
I thought the infrared sensors were supposed to be deadly accurate.
Any thoughts? And yet the pull off is set the same for both the Y and B axis
Pat
Pat
Aiph5u
(Aiph5u (not affiliated with Onefinity))
11
Hey Pat,
I would have assumed that too. I am surprised you report this.
The sensors should repeat to under 10 microns according to the Masso document.
Have you checked your machine for backlash in the Y axis direction? Perhaps check that coupler set screws are all tight, as well as the tension in the ball screws by checking the tightening nuts.
One thing I did when dialing in my Woodworker/Masso G3 build was to use a few methods to see how repeatable homing was.
I 3D printed a holder for a straight pin, and made an ‘end mill’ out of it. After homing, I would choose a random location and use the MDI to move the pin the that location (x100y100 for example). Then I would tape a piece if cardboard under the pin, and lower the Z axis until the pin just broke through the cardboard. Then I would repeat the process of homing/MDI X100Y100/lower Z axis and see how close the pin came to the original hole.
I would use method 1 above, but this time have a dial indicator set up and zero it on the Z axis assembly. After homing, I would MDI Y100 first, then X100, then zero the dial indicator. Repeat this to see how repeatable the motion is when touching off at the end of the X travel. I would then repeat this test, but this time set the dial indicator to zero after moving MDI X100 first, then Y100. Do this after repeated homing cycles. NOTE 1: you don’t need to add a second MDI direction, you could do the test just from the homed position NOTE 2: I usually moved the gantry to various positions before homing in order to see if that influenced homing repeatability.
Unfortunately I don’t have the pin holder file, otherwise I would have been happy to share. Any creative way to hold a pin in a collet would work.
Are you getting help from Masso? They have some troubleshooting guides for electronic components, and their forum experts will certainly help you work through the steps.
I have sent an email with the original homing issue. I will send another email now that (I believe) I have a bad octocoupler. I followed the Masso VFD Troubleshooting video and I do not have voltage between pins 6&7 on the spindle output. That points to failure apparently.
There is a 3D print for a 1/4" collet mounted pencil. That might do the trick if others read this in future
Well after some more testing, backlash is good, the Y motor home repeats near perfect, the B motor, well it is close to repeating but the pull off distance is about .100 less then the Y motor all the time, tried several different pull off settings but it stays off by about .100.
Going to get a hold of Masso to see if they have any ideas.
I could send a video but do not see how to do this here.
Thanks, Pat
There has been a fair bit of discussion in the Masso forums re homing and auto squaring of slaved axes. Here is a great description provided by Masso support of how their controller does it:
The squaring of the axis has nothing to do with when the sensor is triggered or the difference in distance travelled to reach the sensor. It has to do with the back off. Lets say the Y axis is triggered first. It stops and waits for the B axis to arrive. Once both sensors are triggered MASSO starts to back each axis off the sensors and it has to do this within 10mm or it will alarm. It is the point at which the sensor returns to low that is the square reference point. As each sensor turns low the axis stops and waits for the other axis. Once both axis sensors are low the axis is now square and both Y & B axis move the specified pull off distance. Once the pull off distance is reached the axis machine coordinates are set to the values specified in the Home Position for that Axis. The pull off distance should not be used as a way to correct sensor position because it forces the axis to twist out of square and then back into square each time you square the axis.
One thing to note is never to have two different pull off distances for the slaved axes. When you say the Y motor is always .100 less, where are you measuring this from? Is it where the X axis blocks are relative to the Y axis blocks? One reason I mentioned using the MDI and pin method is that your machine may actually be doing everything correctly, it just may look like there is a problem given how you are ‘measuring’ it. One other thing I measured when fine tuning my set up was to check that it is square using the Pythagorean Theorem. I used my ‘pin method’ to place cardboard/pin holes at the vertices of a 30mmx40mmx50mm triangle. I used this size as my precision straight edge only measures to 60mm. As recommended by Masso, I carefully adjusted the position of my Y axis homing sensor until the distance between the 30mm and 40mm line segments was exactly 50mm - I used a magnifying glass, and I think I got within 0.1mm, which was about the line thickness of the rulers smallest increments. So, maybe what you are seeing, is not actually an issue, and if it is, checking for square using the aforementioned method may help better determine that. I do not have an Elite, and I use different sensors, so I am not sure how easy it is to adjust their positions should you wish to try. It probably will not take much adjustment, if any is needed at all.
1 Like
Aiph5u
(Aiph5u (not affiliated with Onefinity))
19
Hey Pat,
to square a machine with limit sensors when you have two Y drivers (Y and B software-slaved on the Masso) and therefore two Y limit sensors, you can adjust the rectangularity (“squaring”) by moving one sensor back or forth by the amount that your machine is out of square (see also here). However, I think it’s good on assembly of the machine to make the machine as square as possible. See here for checking and adjusting rectangularity (“squaring”).
Thanks you for the info provided, one question you asked is where I am measuring, I measure between the homing sensor bracket and the homing sensor trigger, the part that breaks the infrared beam, not from the blocks. Also you mention that you move the sensor to attain square, from what I see, the sensors on the elite are in a fixed position and not adjustable.
I will take a couple of pics and try to upload them
Thanks for your help.
pat
