Hi everyone. Another CNC rookie. Have a Woodworker on order, and a 2.2kw spindle from Jianken to go with it, so pretty excited to learn on it. First dip in to the CNC world (and first post on the forum).
On to the VFD. I’d like to go with Huanyang because I know very little about electronics and it seems like that’s the VFD with the most online help from this forum and others. Lots of great info.
I was minutes away from ordering a 4.0 kw GT series because I thought any Huanyang would be fine, when I ran across a post where someone couldn’t get it to work with the Onefinity controller. Seems like the GT is a little step up from the HY.
Any chance anyone is using the GT series or knows if it can be set up with the Onefinity controller using the breakout board?
Martin, I am a newbie too, and have the same question. Did you decide to stick with the HY model VFD, or find a way to use the GT?
Hey @Tas As you can see no one jumped in here 
, so I went with the Hitachi WJ200 instead. I’m happy with the Hitachi and don’t regret it, but it is a bit more expensive. Gives you Sensorless Vector Control like the GT series among a number of other features. If you’re interested in learning a little about the Hitachi this post and a couple others on the forum have some good info. However, people are successful with the cheaper Chinese VFDs too. Sorry can’t help you specifically on the GT series
Thanks Martin, I will take a look at it too.
Edit: What Spindle did you go with?
Hi @Tas I bought a Jianken 2.2kw water cooled straight from the Chinese manufacturer. Seems like a quality spindle and has worked well for the short time I’ve had it, but I’ve been since told the 2.2kw rating may be “iffy” based on the amps, so I’m not sure I could recommend it or not. I’ll have to push it a little more to know in practice.
I’ve also since heard this G Penny has a bigger rotor and might be usable down to 3,000 rpm, but as with most specs from Chinese manufacturers it’s hard to know. You’d have to order right from AliExpress, I believe.
Otherwise, the “safer” low-cost option is the Huanyang many get. Then there’s the PWCNC option which I heard recently may be G Penny rebranded. And if you have a big budget, something like Mechatron.
Lots of options depending on your budget and risk tolerance
Hey Martin,
which model did you choose?
What do you mean exactly by this?
Hi @Aiph5u
It’s a JGD-80/2.2R24.
It’s rated at 6A and Jianken told me to set VFD to 6A, which apparently is low for a 2.2kw spindle. They gave me the following explanation for their power rating: Power=volt * current * √3. However, they also said overcurrent could go up to 9A.
As I mentioned it seems to be a quality spindle. Ceramic bearings. Came grounded. For what I do in wood and light aluminum hobby work, I think it will be more than capable. So I’m not worried personally. Just not sure if it is rated according to international power standards. Was a little more expensive too, but seems to be a well-established company, and their ATC spindles have gotten some good reviews.
Thanks Martin,
My budget has been hammered by the 1FX50JM, QCW, exchange rates, and shipping, so don’t have heaps to spare for Mecha et all. Even the pwn full kit option looks a bit scary after exchange rates.
I don’t mind putting things together and experimenting a hit, so may look to the Chinese versions initially, possibly with pwn cables. Awesome that this great community exists and seems very helpful and knowledgeable:-). There are a couple of local AU options too, but these look like the Chinese ones, and don’t seem to have cable sets suited to 1F.
Thanks again.
Sure thing. I’ve been helped enormously by the forum, so any little bit I can pass on I’m happy to do that. I’m with you - even though they look like great products, I couldn’t justify the price of the Mechatron, CNC Depot, etc level spindles for my hobby use, but you never know down the road. Taking a minor risk on a relatively decent Chinese spindle seems to be the better way to go for many of us hobbyists.
My brother and I put together and soldered all the cabling ourselves. Doable, but not necessarily fast and easy the first time, especially the cup terminals on the aviation connectors for the spindle. The PWNCNC premade spindle cable is a very nice option, but I’d make sure they can match it to your particular spindle aviation connector before you buy the spindle if you go that route. There are quite a few different aviation connectors out there.
I’m curious what you mean by this. The spindle only connects to the VFD. Then VFD is connected to Onefinity controller over RS-485 cabling.
It’s the VFD to 1F Controller bit that is missing, though of all the cables that should be relatively easy to put together, so might be worth pursuing. For the local option, I still need to try and find out what brand the spindle and VFD are, since their pictures aren’t very detailed.
Looks like a pretty complete solution! Nice to find something that fits your local electrical requirements.
Not seeing any documentation for the spindle or inverter/VFD, but I might have missed it. You’d want to confirm the VFD is compatible with the OF controller or, if not, you or someone else can figure out how to configure it as a custom VFD in Onefinity settings.
I’m assuming you bought the Onefinity breakout board? Then it’s just connecting the two wires on one end of the cable to pins 13 and 14 of the breakout, and the two wires on the other end to your RS485 terminals on the VFD. (Those who know more may tell you it should be grounded. I didn’t). In my case, the polarity did matter, so if you don’t get communication, you can just switch two wires around. Ideally I think you want shielded, twisted pair. This is what I bought. Had to buy 25 ft, but it was cheap. Others may have gotten away with unshielded if you watch the YouTube videos, so I suppose that’s your choice. Fairly simple connections.
Hey Martin,
The formula P=U·I·√3 is correct to calculate the so-called apparent electric power. This is the information that is needed to dimension the power supply and the cables. But if they sold you a spindle as 2.2 kW spindle based on this formula, or if that is the power that is marked on the nameplate, then they fooled you.
According to IEC 60034-1, an electric motor shall be provided with a rating plate on which shall be marked the rated output. According to IEC 60034-1, the rated output is the mechanical power available at the shaft and shall be expressed in watts (W).
For a three-phase induction motor, this calculates this way:
η = Pmech / Pelectr = Pshaft / (UN · IN · √3 · cos φ)
where
η (eta) is the efficiency,
cos φ (cosinus phi) is the power factor,
U is the rated voltage, and
I is the rated current.
So the rated mechanical output power on the nameplate of an induction motor is calculated this way:
Pshaft = UN · IN · √3 · cos φ · η
Let’s say for calculating an example let’s use my spindle. According to its datasheet, in duty type S1 (continuous running duty), the rated voltage and current are:
UN = 230 V
IN = 8 A
I don’t have power factor and efficiency at hand, but let’s use the typical values:
cos φ = 0.82
η = 85%
This spindle is sold as a 2.2 kW spindle, so for the mechanical power available at the shaft, which shall be marked on the nameplate, you calculate:
Pshaft = 230 · 8 · √3 · 0.82 · 85/100 = 2221.32 W
Okay, this is true, it says 2.2 kW on the nameplate. Now for this spindle, the so-called electrical active (real) power is:
Preal = 230 · 8 · √3 · 0.82 = 2613.31 W
And still for this spindle, the so-called electrical apparent power is:
Pappar = 230 · 8 · √3 = 3186.97 VA
Okay, you see, a spindle rated as 2.2 kW spindle in fact sucks an apparent power of 3.2 kVA. The VFDs reflect that: If you have a look at the datasheet of my 2.2 kW VFD, it says, for a typical 2.2 kW induction motor, it provides 3.8 – 4.5 kVA output power (dependent on voltage, 200-240 V) (this VFD is rated for up to 11 A output). And it is sold as 2.2 kW VFD, which means, it is for a spindle that makes 2.2 kW mechanical power available at its shaft.
So now to your spindle: So if they told you they calculate your 2.2 kW power rating by the formula P=U·I·√3, which is the formula for the so-called electrical apparent power, the current calculates this way:
I = P / ( U · √3 )
2200 / ( 220 · √3 ) = 5.77
Which corresponds approx. to the 6 A they told you.
So let’s say the power factor cos φ = 0.82 (a typical value), then the active (real) power is:
Preal = 220 · 5.77 · √3 · 0.82 = 1802.90 W
and let’s say the efficiency is η = 85 % (a typical value) then the rated (mechanically available at the shaft) power is:
Pshaft = 220 · 5.77 · √3 · 0.82 · 85/100 = 1532.47 W
So in fact, to comply to IEC 60034-1, it should have marked “1.5 kW” on the nameplate (and not “2.2 kW”)
Hello @Aiph5u
Thanks for general thoroughness and clarity in your responses. I had some suspicions about the power calculations, but this is the first time I’ve seen the explanation behind it. A nice marketing technique on their part to use a type of “theoretical” power rating, I suppose, rather the “real” power at the spindle we would expect .
In practical terms, I am still generally happy with the spindle so far, as it seems to have more than enough power for what I need. I’ll still probably get decent value out of it for the price, but that remains to be seen over time. Of course, you’d like to get what you paid for - I probably oversized the VFD, and may have to reconsider some feeds/speeds, use of large 1/2" shank bits, etc. Maybe this will help someone else know what they’re getting in to!
Interesting that G Penny, on the other hand, rates their 2.2kW at 10A. According to your formulas, that seems about as unlikely as a 6A 2.2kW spindle.
Out of curiosity, if I were to do some testing on heavy cuts, do you happen to know if these VFD monitoring parameters from the Hitachi would help me “check” the nameplate amperage and kW ratings? Meaning that if d002 shows over 6A during a cut it should trip, d014 shouldn’t really go beyond around 1.5kW (assuming this is more like a 1.5kW spindle), etc I suppose I could also set the VFD to something like 7A and see if the spindle overheats at all.
For completeness, especially for any Australian users looking for a locally supplied Spindle and VFD, the Timbecon supplied “Sherwood” one above is actually Huanyang, with the following part numbers:
Spindle: GDZ-8Q-2.2F
VFD: HY02D223B
VFD Manual: here
So it looks like all the support in these Forums for the Huanyang approach should be applicable to these. It does not seem to have the Braking Resistor installed, but the manual indicates it can be. So I think all that I will need to purchase additionally is the cabling for the VFD to OF Controller and the fittings for it. I have ordered the Timbecon unit today, I guess, when my OFX50JM eventually gets here, we will find out :-).
Additionally, according to Timbecon, this unit is covered by them with 5 year warranty.
Hey Martin,
This indication of apparent power is still quite useful, it is used to size the cables, power supply and fuse. It is a power that actually flows, however, a part flows back again (the so-called reactive power), so that generally the electricity meter is an active power meter and one pays only the active power and not the apparent power. But the apparent power actually flows.
The fact that the IEC has stipulated that the mechanical power at the shaft must be on the nameplate is so that the motors can be compared at all, because that is what you can use in the end. A motor with poor efficiency in industry is not tolerated by politicians these days, as you can see from the creation of efficiency classes.
But the fact that the manufacturer of your spindle (and possibly others) do not comply with IEC 60034-1 is probably not only due to marketing, but probably also because as for the electrical power, you can easily measure it with a multimeter, but the mechanical power can only be measured with the appropriate mechanical measuring equipment. They simply save that.
I think they are also not allowed to print a “CE” mark on the spindle, because in the EU the IEC 60034-1 is valid as EN 60034-1. But I don’t know if your spindle has a CE mark.
I can well imagine that. I certainly wish it to you!
Yes, my position on this is that if you learn about something like this, then you have to inform about it.
If they need 10 A to get 2.2 kW mechanical power at the shaft, according to the formula, they may have a very bad efficiency. But who knows if what they print on the spindle is reliable at all.
There are countless reports about things coming from China that do not meet the standards in the USA or Canada or in the EU. Who could forget the power strips that simply burst into flames when loaded with the rated current, as shown in a consumer magazine on TV. Especially printing the CE mark on something, some Chinese companies seem to have mastered well, maybe before they knew what it means.
However, there is no verification that a product really meets the standards in the EU. The CE mark is merely the manufacturer’s brief declaration that the product complies with the directives in the EU, nothing else.
I would therefore always be careful when buying something on Al*baba or Ali*xpress or Am*zon Marketplace. The products offered there are often not offered there by the manufacturer, but by dealers who buy them as batches, print a fantasy name on them and know little about it.
However with Jianken, you seem to be more on a safer side since they seem to be the manufacturer. They even address the situation.
It’s important to emphasize that not everything that comes from China is bad. It certainly isn’t. If it were, all our computers, smartphones, solar cells and batteries would be bad. Today we can’t get many things from anywhere else but China. There are excellent products from China. The reasons to still try to come back to own production, which the western countries are slowly understanding, are rather, firstly that if chains of suppliers collapse, because chinese authorities simply lock in millions of habitants in their homes, up to the point of letting them die of lacking medication like insuline, or even food, then in the west you suddenly stand there with stopped production lines (or without FFP2/N95 respirators) etc., and secondly that you don’t know under which conditions the products are manufactured in China. It’s great when the West is proud of its human rights and workers’ rights, but has its stuff made where neither exists.
I think “Output Current Monitor [d002]” and “Output Voltage Monitor [d013]” give the real values at the input of the spindle. You calculate the power with the formulae above. For “Input Power Monitor [d014]” I think this means rather the input power of the VFD, not the spindle. The VFD also has its own efficiency, of course, which makes the electrical input power slightly higher than the electrical output power.
As for the actual power at the spindle, you always have to set that in the VFD in the form of the “rated motor current” setting. The VFD then ensures that the power is not exceeded.
Of course, you can experiment with this. But depending on what kind of work you are doing, you may even not reach the power limits of the spindle at all.
This is often not a mistake, because you don’t know what you will expand later. Just be sure to set the motor current limit, just in case you should try a feed speed test on how fast you can transform a piece of wood into chips with a 1/2" roughing bit 
With a spindle, which will simply trip the VFD if it is overloaded (which if correctly emergency-wired, will stop the cnc program running at same time), you can try out what you want without danger (unlike with a hand trim router which may burn your workshop down in this situation).
By the way, I also have an ER20 spindle, and I ordered ER collets with all possible diameters with the spindle. But I think with effective 1.5 kW you are very well able to use 1/2" tools.
Great info Tas. Might even merit a separate “Aussie Onefinity resources” post . 5 year warranty on a rebranded Huanyang kit seems like a pretty nice deal to me.
On the braking unit, I had an odd experience with the official Huanyang salesperson on Amazon. I was strongly considering their VFD and wanted the braking unit. In one e-mail it seemed very clear they were going to install the braking unit itself. Then in another they seemed to indicate they would only install the “capability” to use a braking unit. There were other strange elements to the conversation which eventually led me away from that VFD. Many people have a good experience with the HY VFD, but if the braking unit function is important to you, it might be worthwhile to ask exactly what you’re getting, and what needs to be installed at the factory before it’s sent out.
It might be a language barrier with respect to the installing of a breaking unit vs the capability.
From what I have learned on other forums it is the breaking resistor circuit that needs to be added, and this must be asked for when ordering from the factory. This circuit then allows you to add and use your external breaking resistor.
Thanks for the clarification. I also understood the same thing from them, that the circuit is not default, but has to be requested from them.
Very interesting conversation. I don’t remember a “CE” being printed on my spindle, but I would have to go check. One thing that stands out a bit is the weight at 8.5 kgs. Not sure what that is due too.
Agree and agree. But I suppose that is a big topic for another time.
Yes, still have that at 6A as per the manufacturer. They call it “Level of Electronic Thermal” in my manual. I will be careful if I change that.
Good idea.
Good point.
Something I still need to set up. But hope to before much experimenting with the limits of the spindle power.
Enjoy! It’s a fun hobby
I think once I have the unit and the OF and have it all put together I will write it up so people can repeat if needed. Looking at the doco it looks like there are terminals for a braking resistor ready to install. Whether there is circuitry to back it up remains to be seen. I also noted that the VFD to Spindle cable is only 2m long, which may not be enough to place the VFD appropriately and run cables through a drag chain. Will have to wait and see.
I still have some design work to do for my ideal table, but might actually wait until I have the unit for a while and have used it, so I can properly incorporate the features that are important to me.
Thanks again for your help.